Episode 10 – Traditions and OUR WEDDING!

WE’RE OFFICIALLY ENGAGED!!

Welcome to Jabber Pack! The podcast of 2 lovers discussing a wide variety of things. If you’d like to watch the video version of this, where you can see us playing Halo: Reach in the background, with some occasional reactions from our wolf avatars, you can view it here:

https://youtu.be/bokE-1DUAQ0

Howl is everyone doing? 

Like the title says, we’ve finally decided to tie the knot! After being together for over 11 years, we’ve decided to make it official! Join us as we talk about what led us to finally take the plunge as well as discussions about holidays and other traditions and the ensuing anxiety they cause in people like me.

Thank you for checking this out! We hope to see you bark again soon! 

Our site: https://jabberpack.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:02

How is everybody doing today? And welcome to Jabber Pack. I am Alex. And I am Rogue. And today we are talking about a few things. Uh mostly revolving around the concepts of traditions. Specifically, we're going to delve a little bit into holidays, joys, stresses, and then talk about weddings. A very traditional thing that so many people view very differently, do very differently. So we're going to give our little take on that. Cuz we are preparing to do one ourselves.

SPEAKER_00 0:41

Indeed.

SPEAKER_02 0:42

So as of um how many days has it been?

SPEAKER_00 0:51

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 0:53

I don't know. A handful of days. They've been really melting together. Um we we've been uh we just officially engaged. I would say we've sort of been soft engaged for couple of years. Uh we've been together over eleven at this point. So it's been pretty inevitable, but uh we decided to make it official, and so now we're on that uh planning phase of things that is oh so uh as of about a uh as of about a week ago, uh 16th. Okay. So at the time of the uh recording of this, uh about a week, uh, which was largely why uh we had a delay for a week in our podcast last week. Yes, indeed. So for uh all four of you out there who watch, love you guys, we appreciate it. Sorry for the um sorry for the missed upload. Um but life is life. Can't always be perfect and uh you know But uh we out here now and we are discussing the things again. So uh one of my favorite definitions, and definitions is loosely uh put around this, uh explanations rather. Descriptions? Yeah. For what a tradition is, don't know where I got this, probably from a meme where all good things come.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Uh which is not all, but most.

SPEAKER_02 2:27

Okay, then the next is for a lot of good creative thoughts, but you have to weed out the weird in order to get down to it.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

There you go.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

Uh but uh essentially boils down to tradition is peer pressure from dead people. That uh, well, we do things this way because, well, that's the way they've always been done. And uh it's the way our father did it, it's the way my grandfather did it, and it's how we all will do it. I don't know what that was supposed to be. I apologize to whomever I offended, which is probably a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

Hopefully they take it in good strike, it's all in good fun.

SPEAKER_02 3:08

Yeah. But uh, you know, traditions have different uh nesting doll layers, you know, boiling in the most simplest form down to family traditions where people are like, oh, this is just something me and my mom and dad and brothers and sisters do, and then you uh have traditions of culture identity, traditions of religious identity, traditions of national identity. Um so everybody's just a lovely little ball of yarn mix uh of different places who all more or less pressure them into doing things a certain way. Now, traditions can either be part of celebrations or just a part of your day-to-day routine, and it's very easy in, for example, religious contexts to uh have religion or uh certain traditions throughout your day, like certain types of prayer, certain eating preferences. Um I don't think we're gonna get too much into the religious tradition aspect, but it definitely plays a role, especially in the pressure points of compliance. Uh, because one of the positive things that traditions can do is they give people a sense of togetherness, a sense of belonging, of well, I'm doing this weird diet, this weird thing, whether it's for the sake of just a diet, uh, or the sake of uh a religion or a personal belief, you can at least draw comfort in not being alone. Uh if it's a church, it's like once a week you can meet with your people and say, hey, I uh, you know, this this Lent thing is just, you know, killing me this time. And even if those traditions cause you grief, you get validation for getting through them. But on the lighter side, traditions can actually bring joy, celebration, um, around holidays and harvests. Uh, one of the traditions I always loved of the city I lived in for a good chunk of my life was called Harvest Days. Which is a little odd when I think about it, because uh that particular city is landlocked, and I don't think it has a single farm. The city was built around a mining process factory. So a lot of the early workers were just uh smelters or miners who uh just happen to live in the town. Um so the fact that there's a mining uh a cafe named after mining in the town, that makes sense. The fact that their big annual tradition where they have uh you know vendor booths, live performances in their main city park, and they call it harvest days, that makes no sense the more I think about it. Because what are they harvesting? Now, further to the south, they had some beet farms, but I don't think this particular landlocked city had anything to do with those.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Well, maybe they were just excited that they that's when the harvest was due. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 6:49

They just needed a reason to celebrate. They needed an excuse. Well, and maybe that's another good thing that some holidays are, is they're just an excuse. An excuse to have a party, to visit family you have uh to get a day off. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:09

Let's be honest, half half the people probably half the people in the world look forward to holidays just because it's another day off.

SPEAKER_02 7:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:16

At least in America. Hey, come on. Most other countries actually, you know, have uh reasonable working conditions for employees. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:28

This is one that is one of the primary ones that just uh well, if you're gonna get sick or uh have a personal family thing, you need to let us know like six weeks or more in advance. Because that's how that works.

SPEAKER_00 7:41

And don't forget, if you're sick, even if it's just for one day and you only have to miss one shift, you still have to have a doctor's note.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Oh yeah, of course.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

Because you always have to go to the doctor, even if you just have a simple cold.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:53

Which you know, or or heaven forbid, you know, if you have a chronic condition and it decides to act up for a single day and you know you'll be fine the next day, you'd have you have to have a doctor's note because that you need to have proof that you were sick.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

Oh yeah, and that's gotta come out of your own pocket, because they're not gonna give you insurance, they're not gonna pay you for that day off. So you have to not only miss the day uh miss the day's pay, but you have to take additional money to go see that doctor to get that note, just so you don't get in trouble for missing a day. Even though they're like, in their orientations, they'll always say, Oh yeah, if you're sick, don't come to work. It's like, uh, yeah, that sounds nice on paper, but uh, when uh the rubber meets the road, they they want you there no matter what.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

Yeah, but at least if you're full-time you get some reprieve, because at least then you get PTO and actual sick days, and half the time a full-time employees, you know, actually get insurance, medical insurance. So it doesn't cost you arm or leg just to go see a doctor for a cough.

SPEAKER_02 9:03

Yeah, or you know, the closest thing to medical insurance that we can get here. Not that we're bitter about any of this whatsoever.

SPEAKER_00 9:13

No, no, not at all.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

Anyway, that aside, holidays. They're great. Well, they're great in some ways. Um, another way that uh traditions and holidays help people get through the grind of life is they meter time. In other words, they give people something to look forward to, and they give people something to reflect back on. Uh, because you look at something like uh a dog, they have no concept of, oh, in a week is my birthday. And um so I'm getting excited looking forward to this event coming up in a few days. Now they can get excited for an event coming up in a few seconds or a few minutes. Um I know our dog is really good at learning every little possible sign uh that they're about to go on a walk. And so they take those little signs and they get excited about it. But they can't get that same excitement thinking, oh, um, I'm looking at this clock and I understand it, and in three hours um my pet parent will be home and they're going to take me for a walk. I'm excited for the walk I'm going to have in a few hours. You know, they they have no concept of that kind of time. They're very present moment minded. Uh, but for us humans, we desire more meaning in our life than that, and it's not enough. I mean, it it should be enough, mind you, to be happy with the life you live day to day, um, have full contentment at the start and end of each day. That's great on paper, but realistically speaking, we value community and we value purpose, and having these events that are more overarching than just our mundane grind of the day-to-day work and solving little problems gives us a bigger sense uh of being a part of this planet, of this species, um, and then being a part of whatever group uh that particular event might be based on. So if it's uh, you know, your religion and it's a particular event, then it's a chance for you to bond with that group. If it's your city, then it's a chance to feel, hooray, I'm a part of this little city. Um, and that means more than just uh the individual parts, or more than the sum of our parts. And it helps us guide our brains to rationalize what a year even means. And you can say, well, I remember these specific things because they were big key days. Because our brains don't remember days, they remember moments. Uh and so when you're reflecting back on a year, you're never gonna remember an entire day where, okay, I remember waking up at this time, having this for breakfast, whatever, whatnot. You're gonna remember, oh, how did this particular big event go for me? Like, oh, how was the 4th of July for us US people? Or Thanksgiving, or uh Easter, Christmas, all the big hitters. Uh, they help us put little linch pins in our uh picture of how we get through life. Now, on the surface, this all sounds great, but if you're a psychological, anxious, depressed wad like me, then sometimes these traditions come with sets of expectations that can really eat at your psyche. Because you feel like, oh, well, culturally I'm expected to do certain things on a holiday. Like, on the surface, like you said, a holiday is a day off. And for a lot of people, that's the most valuable aspect, is just getting a day off and having your employer have no problem with that. Just being like, oh, well, everybody gets this day off, so they can't be mad at me. They can't call me and say, hey, we need you to cover for Bill. It's uh it's just a free pass to not have to work and have everybody okay with that. And that intrinsically is probably the biggest factor that you know I enjoy in most holidays. But but then you put the odd pressure of okay, what do I now have to do with this time? Uh because on paper, you take a holiday like Thanksgiving, I think, is about the best one I can think of. Because uh here in the US, we have this pressure to have a big giant meal on Thanksgiving. And every family's gonna have their own different recipes, their own uh ways of going about it. But the big general rule of thumb is you have to have a big meal. Now, uh I do like to cook quite a lot. Uh, and the more I go through life, the more recipes I learn, the more cooking techniques I learn. I mean, I'm no chef or cook by any means, but uh I can hold my own in a kitchen pretty good, and I enjoy making something that other people enjoy. Um but when it comes with this bizarre pressure of, oh, well, we need to have this big meal, and it needs to have these particular pieces, um, then my brain gets more focused on getting through it. I call it being mission-oriented. That instead of focusing on, oh, here's a day where I don't have to worry about working, here's a day where I just get to visit with family and enjoy their company and have a good time, my brain thinks rats. Not only do I have to fill these check marks for the tradition's sake of, oh, I have to uh make sure I'm making enough food and we have enough types of this food in order to pull off this big meal, but I also get this public performance pressure of well, I need to make sure I'm doing enough for the family I'm visiting. You know, am I smiling enough? Am I telling them enough information about my life? Am I contributing enough to the conversation, to the meal itself, um that they're gonna be satisfied that we had a good Thanksgiving. You know, did I did we make enough memories to count it so I can go home and sleep? And that makes it sound really cold and cruel when I put it that way. But um when you're really anxious, that's definitely how it feels. It becomes another assignment, another uh workday in its own right. And I I guess it's justifiable that they give you the day off for that holiday in particular, because it is a lot of work to cook that much extra food, and then have to try and uh put it all away. And I've definitely found as time goes by, uh, which is a really good BBC series um from a while back, check it out. Um starring Judy Dench. Oh, and uh, what's the other guy's name? His last name is Palmer, I think. Not important. But I always feel happier the simpler these events go. And uh on the surface, it makes me seem kind of Grinch-like because the lesser of a production I make about a particular holiday, the better my soul feels having gotten through it. And it's not that I don't want to appreciate the holiday, and definitely not because I don't want to appreciate the family I'm spending time with. It's just that when you have this certain set of expectations that you feel have to be fulfilled, it can be such a relief when they're dialed down a little bit. Like, hey, maybe we don't need to have a turkey, a ham, p uh pudding and stuffing and uh turkey, ham, mashed potatoes, sweet potatoes, uh bucket of a bunch of gravy, a bunch of veggies, pfft. Yeah, sometimes it's like, you know what, let's just cook one of those turkey breasts instead of a big old turkey that takes so much extra work to process. Make some instant mashed potatoes and watch a couple movies, dang it.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

Well no, but that's what holidays are supposed to be. It's supposed to most holidays are supposed to be about bringing people together and celebrating this specific moment. Generally a lot of holidays are surrounded uh have historical background to them.

SPEAKER_01 19:00

Right.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

And it's supposed to be about gathering with people to celebrate that. It's just with time it's become, oh, with this particular holiday, we have to do we have to go all out for again for those in the US. Fourth of July is another one. It's like, oh, you've gotta have barbecues and fireworks, and you're not doing it right if you don't have something grilled up and Yeah. It's like it's a day off to relax, celebrate Independence Day. It doesn't have to be a huge production. It's not a frickin' drama or film stage.

SPEAKER_02 19:42

Yeah. Uh don't even get me started on, you know, uh people who turn their lives into a social media circus about having to have the perfect everything for online presence. I can only imagine the impression.

SPEAKER_00 19:56

I can only imagine their cr their their like Christmases and Halloween.

SPEAKER_02 20:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:02

I mean, can could you imagine if for somebody who revol whose life revolves around their social media presence, they'd have to s they they'd probably spend so much time and stress so much about making sure they have the best displays in the neighborhood. Which I give props to, especially on Halloween, those who go with Halloween and Christmas. I give props to those who go all out with lights and decorations.

SPEAKER_01 20:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:30

But my lord, the amount of time it would take to settle that up, the amount of space you have to have to store all that, the amount of money that was spent to get all of that, and then the amount of time it would take to tear all that down.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:52

It's like, how do you even enjoy it at that point?

SPEAKER_02 20:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:57

I'd be halfway through setting it up and say, you know what, forget it. And just not even touch it for the rest of the year.

SPEAKER_02 21:04

Well, and I think that's one of the reasons I admire my brother because he goes all out, especially for Halloween. And uh but when it comes to the holiday itself, he's uh hardly involved.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:20

Uh and I think it's because for him, like us, he's not a very social person, but he really does enjoy decorating.

SPEAKER_00 21:28

He's more social than we are.

SPEAKER_02 21:30

Yeah. Um so I I feel like he's in it for the right reasons, if you will. He enjoys the holiday. Um, he likes to be festive and uh celebrate the season and decorate accordingly, and you know, he's not competing with any Joneses. He just legitimately loves it, and I admire him so much for that. But it is weird that he usually burns out socially after about like an hour of trickle. Retreaters, and then it's you know up to the rest of us to see it through to the end.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

Which uh I sympathize with him so much, but I just find it odd that well, this is your thing, this is your favorite holiday, man. Um, and why are you abandoning ship uh on the day itself? But it probably comes down to the same thing we were talking about with uh getting too stressed out on like Thanksgiving, where it's like he probably just wants to enjoy the holiday, and the more it turns into running an event, the harder it is to sit back and actually just enjoy it, watch a movie, um, you know, enjoy a good costume or two, you might see, when uh when it's just like it's it's becoming a big production. And I'm proud of what we do on Halloween because uh we used to go back to the house we used to live at. We don't really do anything here where we live now. Um we don't decorate or have trick-or-treaters or anything. But we'll go over there and every year we do hot chocolate if it's cold, um uh cotton candy if we can withstand it. We have little bags uh with candy and stuff in them. Sometimes it'll have uh little trinkets in there as well.

SPEAKER_00 23:26

And popcorn.

SPEAKER_02 23:27

Oh, yeah, and popcorn too. Yeah, for some reason over the years we've just accumulated carnival fare food machines. And we we even bought a little, not very high production, but we got a hot dog roller now, too. So add it to the mix, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 23:44

You know, we're just setting up our own little homemade carnival. It's fine.

SPEAKER_02 23:48

So, um, so it's it's weird because on one hand I feel a little bit grinchy that there's these holidays where I just feel stress of like, you know, I wish I could just be at home, relax, not have to worry about anything, not have to put on any kind of show, um, and not have to worry about uh any kind of pressure to perform something. When on the other hand, there are other times during similar holidays where I do enjoy indulging a little bit. So I don't know where the line in that is drawn, if there even can be a line drawn. It just sometimes it's too much. It uh we get lost in the rat race of how to celebrate a holiday, right, that we forget that oh, we're supposed to just actually be celebrating, actually having fun. And you know, there's trillions of Christmas movies about this where people lose the quote unquote meaning of Christmas or the spirit of Christmas to uh to the rat race of buying and giving presents and uh getting all the decorations right and all this kind of stuff. And uh, you know, having worked retail, we all have our own horror stories about how awful human beings can get during holiday times of year. Um I worked in shipping for a while, and man, everybody just you can't make people happy. Uh all you can do is just tell them what you can tell them, tell them the truth, and if they're not happy with it, that's that's their fault. So if you work a retail job out there, uh just uh stand your ground uh with you the the policies and stuff of your establishment.

SPEAKER_00 26:06

Uh just policies, and if somebody pisses you off too much, go into the back room and scream. It works wonders.

SPEAKER_01 26:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

You can't punch the customers no matter how much you want to. That'll get you fired and arrested. It's not worth it. Just yell into the yell in the back room. If you if you work at a larger grocery store, go into one of the coolers. Trust me, they're soundproof. At least mostly.

SPEAKER_02 26:33

Good to know. Tips for life right there.

SPEAKER_00 26:37

Hey, they might get a little cold, but if you've got a jacket, you can go in there, you can cry in a corner, you can scream at the top of your lungs. Nine chances out of ten, no one's gonna hear you.

SPEAKER_02 26:46

Oh yeah. Man, they used to have a really big walk-in freezer. I mean, nothing compared to like uh a grocery store. Grocery stores are uh have their own uh gargantuan infrastructure, but uh what?

SPEAKER_00 27:01

Depends on the grocery store and what section of the grocery store we're referring to.

SPEAKER_02 27:05

Well, no, but like even just think about like the dairy aisle at your average grocery store. Think about the square footage of fridge space in there. It's it's um really impressive compared to uh but I used to work for IKEA and they had one big walk-in freezer, two big walk-in fridges. And that freezer was about the size of a shed we used to have on uh the property where I used to live. And it just blew my mind uh the size, I mean, and this is just for you know one little restaurant, uh so So yeah, there there's uh fridges, freezers, good place to I I can tell you as somebody who used to work for Walmart, their cooler their at least they're like their produce cooler and their meat lock, their meat cooler, and their freezer aren't that much bigger.

SPEAKER_00 28:06

It really isn't. Walmart and them won't I can guarantee I can tell you for sure, Walmart does not carry as much backstock in frozen products as one might think. Not that big. Yeah, well.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

But at least uh it was my least favorite part of logistics, because um I was on the logistics crew. I do I wasn't even hired to work in the restaurant. But for some reason they thought, well, you know, uh we need to have everybody work under the if if you're on receiving product, you may as well receive the food, too. Um, and that being the most chronically understaffed uh team, from my perception at least, that was quite the maneuver for them to put that on us. Because, you know, we already had an impossible amount of product to place. So good place to be cross-trained, though. No, it wasn't even the first place I learned to drive heavy equipment. That would have been Home Depot. Um, so I'm really good at driving powered equipment. So if anybody ever needs a driver of you name it, uh insert the blank, I'll probably drive it for you. It's uh it's great. Um, but none of that's important. Um what does any of this have to do with holidays? Oh, you were talking about screaming in a cooler. Dealing with customers and holidays. Yeah, and so it's ironic with like Christmas, because you know, Christmas has two sides to it. I mean, it's got more than that, I'm sure. Whatever. But basically, you have your religious side and your commercial side. And in America, by far, the commercial side is much, much bigger uh part of the culture. You know, it's got the religious aspect there to a degree, but for the most part, it's Santa. Give everybody presents. Um, and kids gain a reputation for you know wanting increasingly expensive things, and companies are jack up their prices just so that they can get more money because they know that there's that pressure on parents that well, you gotta buy your kids this thing if you want them to be happy. Um and there's plenty of Christmas movies about money not buying happiness and the frivolousness of commercialism and consumerism and all this good stuff. But you can have as many lovely Hallmark fluffy movies about it as you want. It doesn't take away the reality that it's very cutthroat around that time of year. Because people want uh to be nice in certain ways and have the lovely spirit of Christmas, but as long as all of their needs are met first. Like, oh, I'll have the spirit of Christmas as long as I can get what I need. Oh, I I'll love Christmas as long as my packages make it to everyone who I sent out on time.

SPEAKER_00 31:22

Uh oh, don't forget the c the uh also the uh you know, I'll have a great Christmas if I get this one X, Y, or Z for Christmas.

SPEAKER_02 31:34

Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, it's only a meaningful and good Christmas if I get what I want. It's a very bizarre holiday in how it's evolved. Um which of course, you know, it's it's got very Christian roots and in supposed uh it's supposed to be very Christian rooted in its motivation, and the US being a largely Christian uh country. I mean, we're a melting pot of a lot of things, but uh a lot of our social policies and stuff seem to be based around Christian calendars. Uh but a lot of the good fluffy stuff that you're supposed to glean from that instantly gets dissolved by the consumerism. Like I said, most people have the attitude of, well, all of the good stuff about the holiday, they treat people nice, and the spirit of you know giving and being grateful for what you have. They're okay with that as long as they get everything they want and get everything their way. Then they can make their happy little Facebook posts of yay, humanity, wonderful, give and share love. I love everybody. Family, so it's really important in this holiday season.

unknown 33:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:05

And what I find ironic, then there's no proof behind this, but I would feel the most Karen-esque people out there are also the ones making the most like fluffy love everybody posts. It's it's crazy. I mean, people say there's a shift in who you are the minute you get behind the wheel of a car, but I think there's a shift in who a lot of people are the minute they The minute it's a holiday? Yeah. And that definitely plays into my anxiety for holidays. Because uh you know that people are pretty much going to be on their worst behavior. You see it in how they drive, you see it in how they conduct themselves when going through a store. And so everything around that time of year is more stressful just because you're like, oh, I have to go to the store to get some milk. And you wish you didn't have to, because you know there's gonna be parking is gonna be a nightmare. Driving there's gonna be more complicated if there's snow on the roads, and uh, and then people in how they shop just don't put their best face forward. Now, whether or not that's them showing their true selves, or whether that's them just caving under pressure like a lot of people tend to, varies from person to person.

SPEAKER_00 34:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:40

But what I don't like is people using it as an excuse to be cruel to other human beings. Of, oh, well, I get to be cruel to this person because they told me something I didn't want to hear. Because they didn't have the product I desperately really wanted, either for myself or for somebody else. So it's their fault, they're the ones ruining my Christmas holiday.

SPEAKER_00 35:15

Aunt Helena. I don't know why I pulled that name out of my hat, but it is what it is.

SPEAKER_02 35:22

But it's just it is a true test of character on all sides, of dealing with people when they're at their worst, um, of dealing with your own set of stresses and extra work, extra pressure, um, disappointments about things not working out the way you want, maybe. You know, how do you conduct yourself when things don't go to plan? When somebody tells you something you don't want to hear. Um I think it says a lot about you, uh, who you are. So I would advise anybody out there to remember that everybody is just another piece in this puzzle, another pawn in the system. Everybody's just doing the best they can. We're all human. So don't treat somebody like anything else other than that. People aren't machines. It's not the frontline face's fault that a company didn't have something you wanted, or didn't have it for the price you wanted, or can't get it to you or your loved ones when you wanted. All this time of uh talking about goodwill towards all men and women and other non-binary people, I should say. Um. But it all dissolves the minute our plans don't go exactly how we wanted. But life is about persevering anyway, about figuring out plan B, plan C, plan D.

SPEAKER_00 37:16

Plan the rest of the alphabet.

SPEAKER_02 37:18

Yeah. And I don't think there's any larger planned event when it comes to planning in a lot of people's lives than a wedding. And so now we find ourselves in the oh so lovely wedding planning phase of this.

SPEAKER_00 37:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

So now with marriages, they are weird. Let's be clear about that. Now, in a lot of Disney movies, animated movies, children's shows, they extend the idea of marriage to animals as well. But let's be honest, let's be clear, it's a purely human thing. Uh, you know, animals, you know, some of them mate for life, and that may may as well be considered a marriage, I guess. But it it's a uniquely human thing to have to try to navigate. And, you know, it it makes you wonder what what does marriage even mean? I mean, obviously, we have a legal definition, because when you get down to it, especially in the US, it's a very legal thing. Same with most other parts of the world. It's it's a legal contract, a legal definition of the status of two people in a relationship. But for cultures, subcultures, families, religious, friend groups, and more, uh marriage means something else. I mean, socially, what marriage implies to a lot of people is well, these two individuals are, for lack of a better word, taken. They're uh spoken for. They're off the market. You cannot date these people. They're committed to each other, and they intend to stay committed to each other for a long time. And but what separates uh a relationship before and after marriage is vastly different depending on who you ask. Um like, so depending on your culture, uh some people view marriage as obligation to or permission to have children.

SPEAKER_00 40:14

Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 40:16

Yeah, uh uh uh no. Now, you and I we don't plan to. So for us, that's definitely not what it symbolizes. And I also hate that particular connotation because a lot of people get condemned if, like, oh, they had children and they weren't married. Well, were the parents loving? Did they, you know, want those children? Did do they take good care of them? For me, that's what really matters. But I'm not a religious person, and no for a lot of religious people they feel like, oh, well, marriage is a prerequisite for having children. Especially the church I grew up in. Um I cannot use that word, it's it's it jumbles in my mouth. LDS Church. Mormons. Whatever. I grew up Mormon. LDS, whatever. I am not anymore. Sorry to my extended family, not sorry. But um, it doesn't matter. But marriage is huge in that church. Um you know, they create singles wards, as they call them, to get people who are not married together to encourage commingling, to encourage uh people to get married, essentially. Uh and it's it's a part of their faith that uh it's one of the requirements for their plan of salvation. I won't speak to it a whole lot because I've been separated from it long enough, I can't uh accurately say how or why. I just know that it's essentially a commandment, if not a commandment, in their church, and they view it as just absolutely vital. Uh and they definitely view it as like I said, the permission to versus obligation to have children. Uh and that and that's always bothered me. Um in any context, to view weddings in that way. Of, oh, they're only getting married because not to put it crude, but oh, they're getting married now because they want to breed. Um but that's the unspoken understanding a lot of um dare I call it old-fashioned minded uh cultural view on it is honestly communicating. Is that it's just a transaction to signify that. And I just find that a little gross and weird, and uh if you take it a step further, some cultures view it very transactionally in the uh male-dominated sense of ownership of oh, it's a transaction of a father giving up ownership of his daughter to the groom now.

SPEAKER_00 43:52

Which let's that's just weird and gross.

SPEAKER_02 43:55

That's super gross and very one sided. Yeah. But uh, you know, and that's not even to mention arranged marriages and all the gross implications in that, or the uh marriage is done for like the sake of alliances where it's like a a bride would just be a gift to a foreign dignitary.

SPEAKER_00 44:26

Yes, I'm going to give you my daughter so you don't blow up our land. Yeah, that that that ugh very yuck. Okay, I need a drink. Those words taste are bad coming out of my mouth.

SPEAKER_02 44:43

I know, it's it's it's why I asked the question of like, well, what does marriage even mean? It's it can mean so many weird things. And I suppose we're boiling it down to, well, what does it mean to us? Why are we choosing to get married now? Which is a question I've already been asked more times than I care to have been.

SPEAKER_00 45:12

Haven't we both?

SPEAKER_02 45:14

Yes. But but you know, for anybody out there who who ever plans to get married, you you gotta be prepared for that. Uh people just bombard you with questions about everything. About, oh, cool, you're getting married. Why are you choosing to get married now? Where are you going to get married? When are you going to get married? Where are you going on a honeymoon? Um, how did you go on a honeymoon? How did you propose?

SPEAKER_00 45:41

Did you propose?

SPEAKER_02 45:43

Yeah, see now that's uh that's the interesting thing in our case because there was not a formal proposal.

SPEAKER_00 45:52

Which I'm fine with that. Don't get it wrong.

SPEAKER_02 45:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:56

I did not want a formal proposal. That's not who we are.

SPEAKER_02 46:00

Yeah, and like but that's one of the things that uh probably delayed the process, if I'm being honest, is I thought, oh shoot, man, I I want to marry you, but I also don't want to screw up the proposal. Um, and that's something that's been drilled into my head because of cultural tradition of oh, well, these proposals have to be this big, grand, romantic gesture. And I love you very much. And I that means I love you enough to know you well enough to know that you would be appalled if I put you in this center of attention, uh, public situations.

SPEAKER_00 46:48

Especially being a huge introvert and having social anxiety and not like I will be the one who would rather sit there in the corner at a restaurant and let somebody else order for me than have to talk to people. I don't like talking to people. If I'm at work, if when I I This is coming from somebody who worked in retail. I when I was working in retail, I could carry through the conversations on all day long with my customers because I had to.

SPEAKER_02 47:16

Yeah, when you're forced to.

SPEAKER_00 47:18

Did I want to go home at the end of the day, completely shut down, stick my head in a book, and not come out of it for 12 hours at minimum? Hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01 47:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:28

So no, if you had even considered this huge public proposal, I would have questioned who the heck you were and what the heck Crypt did replaced you with my actual um now fiance, because that would have been completely unlike you, and it would have had me creeped out.

SPEAKER_02 47:48

Well, and that's one of the things that we basically have decided is we're making this very much about us. About the way we love each other and the way we want this done. And so, uh, from some people's standpoints, it means, oh, we're doing it wrong. But I think the people stuck in that mindset have those cultural norms burned into their head, or maybe even their own experiences, which might have been very fulfilling to them, uh, burned in their head. So they think, oh, well, if if we're not doing it that way, then we must be doing it either wrong inherently or for the wrong reasons intrinsically. Which just isn't the case, because let's be honest, to answer the question of, okay, are we doing this for the right reasons or are we doing it the right way, we have to answer the question, well, why are we doing it at all? Because we've been together for over 11 years at this point. Um, and so uh we've we've discussed it quite a bit in the past. Always as a, well, we'll probably get around to doing that one of these days. Um I I know for me I was scared to pick my words because I didn't want to accidentally do a really half-assed proposal when we had conversations like that. Because I'm like, oh no, if I say like, oh yeah, we should totally get married, you know. I was worried, oh no, would you consider that to be the proposal right then? And then you'd be disappointed because it wasn't this big grand romantic gesture that proposals are supposed to be, where you're supposed to hire a sky rider or shout up from the rooftops, or well, let's be honest.

SPEAKER_00 49:54

It also tardy, how different was it actually when we decided let's actually get married? It wasn't that much different of a conversation than that.

SPEAKER_02 50:04

Yeah, that's very true.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

I mean, the the topic came up while we were because the topic came up when we were sitting waiting for your mom at a demo appointment.

SPEAKER_02 50:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 50:15

We started talking about, oh, maybe that's something we should do sometime this year.

SPEAKER_02 50:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

And it was like, okay, well, why don't we look into see what it would what it would take to do something simple? And what was it like two or three weeks of talking about it on and off and doing research about it? We just at what was it like 10 o'clock at night?

SPEAKER_02 50:49

Something. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:50

I'm pretty sure it was like ten no, I think it was actually around eight o'clock at night. It might have been eight o'clock at night because I remember it was like ten o'clock Eastern time. But it was like at eight o'clock at night we just said, you know what, let's let's just do it.

SPEAKER_02 51:05

Yeah. Why wait? Yeah, it came down to the conversation of, well, why haven't we? Um, and it came down to a lot of the reasons we haven't is just the social anxiety aspect of just, well, um, well, first of all, our relationship exists in such a way that we're pretty stable. We're not I mean, not mentally.

SPEAKER_00 51:33

We're both nuts, but I'm kookabanas, but that's exactly the point.

SPEAKER_02 51:38

But uh but in regards to where our relationship's going, it's not like either of us are worried about the other one immediately running away or finding somebody new.

SPEAKER_00 51:50

If that was gonna happen, that would have probably happened over ten years ago. Because uh I mean, let's be honest, the one who probably would have run away first would have been you, because I'm an absolute lunatic and you've met my family. I come from a line of lunatics. Lovable lunatics, but lunatics nonetheless.

SPEAKER_02 52:08

You all should get shirts that say that on it. Lovable lunatics.

SPEAKER_00 52:12

Are you kidding? When I was a kid, I remember distinctly going to when we went when we ended up going to a trip to Disney Um for a family member that had passed away. I was a kid, I don't remember who the family member was. It was my mom's side of the family, I couldn't tell you much about it. But I distinctly remember when we landed in Florida, we were met at the airport by our uh by my mom's side of the family and given shirts. We all ended up with gold matching t-shirts that we all ended up having, that we all ended up wearing the first day we were there. So that way we could easily find each other in the parks, even though none of the mom's extended none of my extended family on my mom's side. We didn't hang out with hardly any of them while we were at Disney. It was literally just my broth my my sibling, my parents, and myself. We're our own little group, didn't really see any of our real uh extended family members or anything. Except for maybe when we went back to the hotel, because m half of them hang up by the pool at the hotel. For most of the time we were in Disney.

SPEAKER_02 53:39

It's funny. Uh the only time I ever swam at a no, twice. So I've been in a lot of hotels that have pools, but only twice in my life have I sw swam at the pool. And one of those times was when I was at Disneyland, so Yeah, I don't remember swimming at the pool.

SPEAKER_00 53:57

I honestly can't say I ever remember swimming at a hotel pool.

SPEAKER_01 54:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:02

I've stayed in several hotels, but I can't remember a single time I've actually swam in a hotel pool. But we're getting off topic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:14

Well, uh. I think uh with so I think what we wanted to talk about in where we were going, and even if it's not where we're going, it's where we are now.

SPEAKER_00 54:35

Of who cares where we were going? It's a matter of where we are.

SPEAKER_02 54:38

Indeed. Live in the moment, guys. Um but what drove us to this? Because I know for a long time we talked about, well, our relationship isn't really going anywhere. I mean that that sounds um pessimistic when I put it that way. Um I don't mean it that way. I mean we're not going anywhere.

SPEAKER_00 55:03

Our relationship isn't changing.

SPEAKER_02 55:06

Yeah. And so, you know, so so why bother with the title? Because we've viewed it as that way for a long time. That, well, marriage is just it's just a title. It's it's a legal thing. Because neither of us are really uh part of a religion, so we don't really subscribe to a lot of the weight and importance that religions put on marriage. Uh, but from a cultural standpoint, um, I never minded the idea of being married. It's just the process of getting married.

SPEAKER_00 55:47

Um too many reddit horror stories.

SPEAKER_02 55:50

Yeah. So many horror stories.

SPEAKER_00 55:55

Kind of dissuade the process to kind of dissuade it a little bit there.

SPEAKER_02 56:00

Well, because there's nothing wrong with people putting a lot of importance around this event. Because it is a major milestone in a lot of people's lives. And depending on what it means to you and what change it symbolizes for you, I can understand making a bit of an event about it.

SPEAKER_00 56:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:22

Um and some people even view weddings kind of tragically. There's this very somber spirit about them. And I'm not talking about people who do goth weddings. That's that's rockin' awesome.

SPEAKER_00 56:37

Um But I mean Let's be honest, if there was if we ended up doing if we ever ended up having a larger ceremony, not a chance in hell, I'm too much of an introvert, you're too much of an introvert. But say in another life, we weren't as introverted and ended up having a larger ceremony, it definitely wouldn't be a traditional one.

SPEAKER_02 56:59

No.

SPEAKER_00 57:00

We're too nerdy for that.

SPEAKER_02 57:02

No, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:05

I could see us pulling it like having either a sci fi-esque wedding, uh, or like a very book focused wedding, like taking aspects from different books we've read. Yeah. That would be cool.

SPEAKER_02 57:22

Yeah. Get a little medieval uh fantasy vibe to the whole thing.

unknown 57:27

Oh heck yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:28

Have the parishioner wearing like some sort of wizard's get up. I mean, come on, that'd be pretty awesome. I mean, I've seen some pretty epic Lord of the Rings themed weddings.

SPEAKER_00 57:37

You'd have to be holding a staff in one hand and the and the book in the other.

SPEAKER_02 57:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:41

Well, let's be honest, that would have to be how it would be.

SPEAKER_02 57:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:45

Every every table would have a dragon centerpiece. Aww.

SPEAKER_02 57:49

Cute. Yeah, but see, some would argue, well, why don't you do that then? Uh one, money, two, social.

SPEAKER_00 58:00

Well, one, two, three, money, four, five, through ten. Uh no, too many people.

unknown 58:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 58:10

Crowded. I'd literally, I'd go up and say, yeah, sure, let's go it. I do, I'm leaving. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 58:19

Well, and like I said with the whole Thanksgiving thing, I would be so stuck on the running of the event, making sure everything was right. Um, and you know, even from my point of view, like, oh, I've got to play my part right, uh, that it'd be impossible to enjoy the event, and that would be so wasteful. And I think that's why we want it to be, you know, so small scale for us. Because for us, it isn't about the pageantry, because some people get so lost in the pageantry of, oh, everything has to be perfect. I have to have a big venue, big expensive dress, and centerpieces and flowers everywhere, and everybody has to be matching, and everybody has to act a perfect way, dress a perfect way, be perfect in these photos. And it's like, okay, well, where in all of this are you supposed to be enjoying the fact that you're symbolizing joining your life with another human being? You know, where is the uh people hire wedding planners?

SPEAKER_00 59:28

Well, yeah. But again, you're talking something that easily is gonna cost you several hundred, if not a couple thousand dollars, to have somebody planning your event, which one, unless you're 100% sure that they're gonna plan it the way you want, I wouldn't trust a wedding planner. No offense to anybody who might be out there who's out there who might be a wedding planner who's listening. I apologize. But I wouldn't trust somebody else to do things exactly the way I'd want them.

SPEAKER_02 59:59

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:00

Or I envision them. Because my brain is so frickin' scattered sometimes. Because neurof neuro neurodivergency is a very interesting thing at times.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:13

So my brain has to have things exactly the way I want it or it's going to short circuit.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:24

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:25

So to the idea of having this extravagant event first of all, again, socially, no, but the idea of having an extravagant event planned out by somebody else who you just relayed your ideas to and they put it all together. Just no, it doesn't sit right. Mentally, it doesn't sit right.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:54

Yeah. And so our whole reason for doing this, um, really is just because we decided to try to overcome the fear uh caused by hearing all these horror stories, the fear caused by all these expectations of, well, this is what a wedding is supposed to be. It's like, well, you know what? We're gonna say nuts to all of that because we love each other, we're committed to each other, we're here for each other. We've gone through the trials of living together that most people wait until after they're married to do, which is just completely bonkers to me, to say, oh, well, I'm not even gonna see whether or not we can handle each other as roommates until we're actually committed till death do us part.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:50

People wonder why divorce divorce rates in the America are high.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:54

Yeah. Uh so you know, we've established that we get along pretty well and we solve problems together fairly well. Because in life, you're gonna have disappointments, you're gonna have times that are low where you feel like nothing, and how somebody treats you when you feel like nothing, and how you treat them when they feel like nothing means a lot.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:27

And what it even means to quote unquote be there for somebody. That that that's such a generic term. Uh, what does it mean to be there for somebody? Uh, but that's something you learn in living together when you love each other, is knowing, okay, sometimes the best way to be there for somebody is counterintuitive, and it means leave them alone, give them space. Understanding the times when they do need the comfort, they do need the support, they do need suggestions for help, and then understanding the times when they need when it's better to leave them alone in their own little corner of the world and let them do their own thing. Yeah. And so the thought of having two people not having figured any of that out and saying, oh yeah, we're gonna okay, till death do us part. Shoot, let's go. Woohoo! Like, are you guys insane? I mean, I've seen some marriages fall to g fall apart pretty fast in my life. Um, and that's probably one of the main reasons is well, they haven't had the trial run of figuring out are you even good roommates? Because that's more important than you think. Now you might now some rich people, sure, they have big houses and they can live completely apart and never have to see each other, but then again, why are you married? Um it's bizarre. It's different for everybody else. I think for us, what marriage means is you know what? I am not waiting for everything in life to be perfect to celebrate that I found somebody who helps me get through life in such an amazingly positive way that I want to spend the rest of my life with them. And that's what it means to me.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:30

Yeah, I don't know. It it's definitely for me, it's definitely one of those I I don't want to wait until the until we're quote unquote financially stable or you know we we uh have our own pla our own house or whatever XYZ standard is constantly put out there of what you should have, what position you should be in before you get married. I I don't want to have to wait for those factors to say, hey world, look, I found my person, and I want to celebrate that I found my person.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:15

Yeah. And so we're not waiting anymore. We decided you. Yeah, and so I mean, this year we're we're making a lot of changes in our lives. We launched this podcast this year. Uh I'm trying to become more active um in content creation, and which is something I've wanted to do most of my life, and I just kept putting it off for who knows what reason. So this has very much become the year of us trying to stand up for who we are.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:54

We're just taking control of our lives.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:57

Yeah. Without waiting. You're all right. Um you know, but without waiting for everything to be perfect, because uh there's a phrase I'll misquote, but close enough of you know, if you always are waiting for the perfect moment, you'll wait your entire life. And that could be true for something like this, uh, a marriage, it could be true for trying to achieve goals that matter to you in life, um, you know, trying something new or doing something that you're really passionate about. Um, there's so many excuses, and for somebody like myself with anxiety, it's easy to get caught up in them of all these reasons why it's never the right time to do something. It's never the right time to shoot for your dreams, it's never the right time to uh live your life the way you feel is right for yourself. Um and eventually you have to take a step back and say, well, why? Why are all these voices in my head telling me it's never the right time for anything? Why am I always thinking, oh, that'll just end up in failure? I have to wait until X, Y, and Z. I mean, life is never perfect. Life is messy, and we're surrounded by billions of humans interacting on a daily basis that make things infinitely complicated. So there's never going to be a perfect moment, a perfect context for anything. And I feel now, this year, stronger than ever, that it's the time in my life to just not worry about the perfect moment. And so I'm diving in head first into a lot of things. And sometimes when you dive in head first, you look like an idiot for five minutes, but that's how you learn, that's how you grow. And uh I'm ready to learn and grow even more with you. Uh now, you know, with this change to our lives, it's it doesn't feel overly drastic, it feels very semantic in a lot of ways. And I think, as I said before, we've wanted to be married for a long time, but going through the process of it has sort of deterred us for longer than it should have.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:37

And even now, we're we're trying our best to keep the whole event as small and simple as possible because we want it to just be a celebration of our life, of our love. And um, but uh, you know, that there's always that pressure to make it more than that. And so we're fighting really hard right now to just be like, you know what, this is our thing, this is our day. And maybe if it was you and uh and it was your day, somebody else, then you would do it differently. And that's okay, whatever makes you happy. But for us, what makes us happy is stressing about it as little as possible because we don't need a huge over-the-top ceremony, we don't need the perfect pictures, the perfect outfits, the um huge guest lists and matching clothes and uh expensive photographer in order to say, like, oh yes, our love is valid, our love is true.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:42

Okay, but you said about the matching clothes, but our outfits do kind of match, so yes, they do. So you gotta you gotta mix that one.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:50

Okay, okay. But but I mean some people go nuclear about that whole thing. You know, the the the term bridezilla is is common.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:59

The biggest the bigger thing is not so much the matching clothes, but the big the fancy white dress.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:08

That's one of the biggest things for for brides is to find that perfect white wedding dress. And for me, I'm sorry, I kind of cut you off. I apologize.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:26

Go on. I feel like you said my piece.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:29

For me I've always said for as long as I can remember have never liked the idea of a white wedding dress. It's never been my it's never been on my list of things that I'd want if even if I wasn't a so socially awkward introvert. That was hard to say. Even if I wasn't this huge a huge introvert and you know, wanted to go all out for a wedding and put in this huge thing. A white wedding dress was never on that list of things I'd want to have.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:11

Cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:12

I've always, as silly as it sounds, coming from somebody who is a who grew up as a massive tomboy, um even to this day, still don't like wearing a lot of dresses and skirts and such, I will dress up occasionally, though. This is one of those times I will dress up. But even with that, I always more pictured, and this is my inner Disney nerd talking, a more princess-esque dress. Because I always thought, you know, if I'm going to have this huge celebration, this huge wedding, I'm going to wear a dress or wear an outfit that isn't a one-time occasion wear.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:07

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:08

I'm going to get something that I could wear after my wedding if I so desire. But let's be honest, white wedding dresses chances of you wearing that after your wedding are slim to none. Most people will keep their dresses, their wedding dress, locked up for sentimental reasons, pass on to their kids. Um but I'm sorry. I know for me, I wouldn't want to wear her wedding if I had the opportunity to wear, like, say, my mom's wedding dress, which I don't I'm 90% positive shouldn't we would have. Even if she did and I and she kept it to pass down to her daughter, I wouldn't wear it, because I don't have the same style as her. I don't have the same likes as her.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:59

She could have absolutely loved the outfit she wore on her wedding day. And it'd be something that I thought was okay, it's a nice dress, but it's not something I'd wear.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:08

Yeah, and it's another one of those weird pressures of like if that was offered to you, it'd be like, oh crap, you know, are you are you gonna disappoint somebody if you tell them no? Uh, especially if it's something that's been passed down, then uh so it's it's been an interesting time for us to try and stand up for ourselves to say, you know what, maybe what we want isn't the most traditional by most people's senses. But it's it's what we want. It's what makes us happy.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:39

Yeah, and I'll be honest, when we were shopping uh the other day and I found the dress I got.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:46

I I honestly uh I did feel bad because I didn't know how to tell your mom I didn't really like the dress she pegged.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:59

That's part of the trouble.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:02

Because it's one of those and this might be getting off of the topic a little bit, but it's always one of those social pressures, especially if you're shopping for a bigger occasion with somebody else who might not fully understand you or your interests or what you like, you always have that pressure of if you say you don't really care for it, are you gonna upset?

SPEAKER_02 1:14:36

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:38

And in the scenario of with the dress I found, I saw it and instantly fell in love with it. And the one that your mom had found, I didn't mind the style of it, but the color just wasn't me.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:00

Fair enough.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:01

But it was still that social pressure or that that awkward pressure of oh well you should try it on anyway. Because you don't know, you might end up you you might it might fit you really well. But if I'm getting married, I want it to be under my I want things to be under my circumstances. I I want to wear what I want to wear, what I'm comfortable in, not something that I won't got out of social pressure.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:31

Right. And at the end of the day, I think what made the difference in deciding to actually get married was when we did the research and we realized it's not as it's not gonna it doesn't have to be rather as expensive or complicated as we were fearing.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:53

And so when we learned that logistically it wasn't this huge it didn't have to be a huge thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:01

Logistically, it's not a huge undertaking or expense.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:06

Then I think that's what turned on the light bulb in our heads to say, oh, well, now that's something we actually could see ourselves doing. Because I think that's, you know, it's something we are afraid of, not because it's uh something we didn't want, but it's because it's something that just seemed gargantuan, seemed like a big headache, no matter how you slice it. So many people talk about what a major undertaking weddings are, and we just didn't want that, and we still don't want that.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:36

You know, so we're doing our best to say, hey, you know what? We want that symbolism, we want that uh certificate to to say, hey, you know what, world, uh, this is who we are. We're uh we're a couple, we're getting through life together, we're committed to each other, we love each other. Um, but we don't need a huge pageant to prove that. You know, we we don't need to meet other people's cultures, religions, expectations for what it's supposed to mean in order for it to be meaningful to us.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:15

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:16

So my hope is that it goes smooth and that we uh it can be as fun as possible without uh having too much headache.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:31

Again, if somebody decides that they want to try to take it upon themselves to make the day more focused on them or somebody else and not us, then I will introduce them to my dress shoes in a not so fun way.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:44

Hooray. But I I'm excited and nervous, apprehensive, but I'm also grateful that we've known each other as long as we have, and that we've solved problems, we've seen each other at each other's lowest points, um, you know, through hurt and pain and disappointment and struggle, and the struggle's still there.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:16

I mean, uh and America, of course it is.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:19

Yeah. And it it's not about saying, okay, we're both at this perfect prosperous point or perfect mental point where we're um uh at perfect zen with the world. It's like, no, it's a mission of we're mortal and life is short, life is precious, and you shouldn't sit around and wait for everybody else's checkboxes to be filled if what you have, what you want, what you're ready for, has been in front of you the whole time. So go out. Live your dreams, do something different.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:06

Take the chance.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:08

Yeah. Uh but I think I've uh I think I've said my piece on this. I don't know if you had anything else uh you wanted to add. Well, then whoever has had the opportunity to listen to this, thank you for listening to uh uh us on taking another step in our journey of life together. Uh a step that for some people it's a monumental leap, but for us it's kind of just a it's a paperwork shift. Uh that doesn't make it any less meaningful or, you know, make me love you any less. The it in fact it's a symbol of how much we do love each other, of how much friction we're trying to take out of this process. Um, you know, that we want to be married, but we don't want this huge you know, we don't want to make a parade out of it.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:09

We just wanna We want to be married, we just don't want it to become a spectacle.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:14

Yeah. Just want a little celebration for very small group of people, call it a day, and wake up and keep living life the next day. Because it's not like a huge magic change is happening, it's a bit of a legal change is happening. And um I I guess I'm proud of that in the sense that you know, if I felt like, oh, so much is gonna change once we're married, it's like, well, if that's the case, if you feel like your whole relationship is gonna change, then is your relationship really at a good enough point to get married?

SPEAKER_01 1:20:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:53

It's like for me, it it was you know, uh, it's kind of like how we didn't have a very formal proposal, it's because for us it was obvious. We didn't need um some big grand gesture to tell uh to tell us, okay, it's it's okay to go. It's you know, it's it's time. And so we'll uh we probably won't talk about it extensively in the next few podcasts, but probably after the wedding itself is over, we'll probably mention it in that particular podcast. Just to say, well, here's how it went. Hopefully it didn't turn into a cuckoo banana's Reddit story. Knock on wood.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:40

I mean, even if it does, you know, you just refer to the you can just put the uh link to the podcast on the on the Reddit thread and increase our views, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:21:51

Oh sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:55

Not the way I want to do it, but you know what? When life gives you limits, make content.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:03

Fair enough. I mean life's unpredictable. May as well uh if if uh if you're not laughing at it, at least get some other people to laugh at it. You know, if we bring joy to somebody's life. But you bring joy to my life.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:19

And you bring joy to those were words. I was trying to say you bring joy to mine, but apparently my mouth didn't want to say that.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:26

Wonderful. Well, I'm happy that uh we got this chance to talk a little bit about traditions, weddings, uh, holidays. Uh for any of you listening out there, uh, it'd be fun to hear about any of your particular uh favorite traditions or least favorite traditions. Anything you feel like, oh, I only do this because I'm obligated and uh it's not fun. Uh have you ever gone through something that was supposed to be fun, but you felt like was ruined because of all the pressure of how you were supposed to act or what you were supposed to do? Um, I'd love to hear about it. Uh but until uh we see you all again, we hope to see you uh bark next week. Hopefully you won't be on another hiatus, but you know, planning these things does take a lot more time out of your life than you expect. So um, see you next week. Knock and wood, hopefully. Love you guys out there. Have a wonderful, safe week. Treat yourselves well, and talk to you again soon.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:33

Thanks for joining.